Dynasty League Football

Uncategorized

Dynasty Dilemma: Mark Ingram

 

This is what I got with the first overall pick in my rookie draft!?!

You can still hear dynasty owners screaming from the rooftops as Mark Ingram was drafted first overall in many rookie drafts, then followed it up by averaging just 12 carries per game and having his season cut short by a turf toe injury for the Saints in 2011. For the year, Ingram was only able to post 474 yards and five touchdowns on a less than stellar 3.9 yards per carry average. Simply put, he failed to become a workhorse or produce the rookie season that many, especially those who drafted him, expected.

That, my friends, is at the core of this dynasty dilemma – expectations can be a dangerous thing in fantasy football.

The problem that many have with Ingram was expecting way too much, way too soon. We’ve been spoiled by players like Adrian Peterson, who instantly reward owners who invest the top pick in the draft with a fabulous season, worthy of the high price paid for their rights. When that becomes the rule instead of the exception in the minds of owners, things go wildly haywire in terms of perception. Those investing the highest of rookie picks look for instant gratification since they likely turned down offers of valuable players in return for the pick they burned. Regardless of how sure you may be on a player, the rookie draft is, and always will be, a crapshoot.

Let’s try to get things back in focus, shall we?

In order to truly judge Ingram’s value in this dilemma, you have to throw away any preconceived value he has based on where you or any others may have drafted him. It just doesn’t matter in the end. After all, we don’t penalize the owners of Victor Cruz or Arian Foster because they were originally undrafted free agents in many leagues, do we?  They are what they are, regardless of how anyone acquired them.

With Ingram, like so many dynasty dilemmas before him, there’s good and bad. Let’s start with the side of the optimists.

First, he’s played ten games in his career.  Ten. For those who want to bail on him, that’s just over half a season here, folks. If you think you can definitively say you know exactly how his career is going to shape up based on that small of a sample size, you’re either clairvoyant or drunk.

Ingram also had surgery to repair his turf toe issue. While that cut short his season, that should give him more than enough time to recover fully and finally be 100% going into the year. Regardless of his rookie season performance, it’s pretty tough to look at the Saints roster and say that a healthy Ingram isn’t better than the likes of Pierre Thomas or Chris Ivory.

Finally, Ingram finds himself as no worse than the power back option on an explosive offense. If that’s his floor, it’s still not bad. That’s going to give him a realistic chance at 8-10 touchdowns just based on how good the Saints are on that side of the ball. His ceiling could be much higher as well. If he can get into camp healthy, there’s a chance he looks good enough to leave on the field in any non-passing situation where Darren Sproles would fit in.

Of course, there’s a downside here, too.

You can easily say Ingram is better than Thomas, Ivory or virtually any other conventional running back the Saints have outside of Sproles, but that doesn’t mean those guys are going away, either. The Saints seem very content with using a big committee of backs and having 1/3 of any committee, regardless of their collective explosiveness, is going to provide any owner with an element of running back consistency that leaves a lot to be desired.

You hate to say it this early, but Ingram also seems to be injured a lot. After dealing with a heel injury and the lingering turf toe problem, it brings to question his durability. While you hope these issues are behind him, seeing a full season from Ingram will make his owners feel a lot better. Feet are just always a source of concern with runners.

Finally, Ingram didn’t look naturally dynamic last year and only averaged 3.9 yards per carry. When you take out his long run of 35 yards, that average shrinks down to a very pedestrian 3.6 yards per carry. The aforementioned Pierre Thomas averaged a healthy 5.1 and Darren Sproles averaged a robust 6.9 behind the same offensive line. While that stat needs to be taken with a grain of salt since Ingram was asked to do a lot of damage in short yardage situations, it still raises a bit of a red flag.

So, now what?

As I said before, you have to simply throw out his draft position and look at him in a different, unbiased light. When I evaluate Ingram, I see a powerful running back who had a run of bad luck in terms of injuries last season. Simply put, I don’t think we ever saw what he was capable of last season.

On the same token, I also see a player who has a whole lot of competition for touches. The days of the workhorse running back are going away quickly and just because Ingram may fit the prototype, that doesn’t mean he’ll ever be used as a true featured back. In fact, the Saints would be foolish to do that with the roster they have.

In the end, Ingram is a player with solid RB2 potential. Likely nothing more, hopefully nothing less. If you burned the 1.1 pick on a RB2 last season, that’s a harsh reality to face if you expected more. If you’re attempting to move him or trade for him, you should ask for and expect to receive nothing more than that type of value.

Like I said, expectations are a dangerous thing.

Ken Kelly
68 Comments
0 0 votes
Article Rating
Subscribe
Notify of
68 Comments
Oldest
Newest Most Voted
Inline Feedbacks
View all comments
StevieMo
10 years ago

I believe in Ingram.

Luke
Reply to  StevieMo
10 years ago

I’m going to guess that you picked him in last year’s rookie draft. It seems that everyone who drafted him still thinks he’s gonna be a RB1 and won’t trade him for less. Meanwhile, most non-owners see the negativity about him, and think of him as a RB2 at best. I haven’t seen many trades of Ingram due to this fact

Dan
Reply to  Luke
10 years ago

In my league Ingram got traded a total of four times in two weeks as a secondary piece , So i think this means that people think he has value to get in a trade but not enough to hold on to him. I have him now and Just offered him and other pieces to another team. So that could be 5 trades for him

Josh G
Reply to  Luke
10 years ago

I had him for all of 2 or 3 weeks last year and ended up trading Ingram and Stevan Ridley and a late round pick for Kendall Hunter, Daniel Thomas and 1.01

D. Thomas’ jury is out, but I will be forced to drop him this off-season. I have someone willing to give me 1.05 for Hunter, but I am keeping him for now as I think 1 full year with a reasonable amount of carries can hopefully showcase his ability…and 1.01 this year seems to be better than 1.01 last year..so it was more than worth it to me.

Scott
Reply to  Josh G
10 years ago

If you can get anyone to trade a 1.05 for Kendall Hunter, that’s a trade I would make. I’m not convinced that Hunter will be anything more than a third-down, change of pace RB. 1.05 is great value for Hunter, IMO.

I’m also surprised you were able to get 1.01, D Thomas and Hunter for Ridley/Ingram/late round pick. Good for you, but the other side of that deal had to be smoking bleach to make that trade.

Josh G
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

I dont need anything at 1.05, hence I am keeping Hunter.

RBs: Forte, McFadden, Foster, Hunter and Trent Rich with 1.01

WRs: Megatron, Nicks, AJ Green, Dez Bryant

And the person willing to trade 1.05 has Gore and not much else at RB..hence he is slightly overpaying…but with the keepers I have and am allowed to keep..its not worth it to me until next off-season.

Josh G
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

hilarious you have people give me negative votes for no reason.

Cyrus
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

They are giving you negative votes because you state that you don’t “need anything at 1.05.”

Basically, any of the RB’s available at 1.05 in this draft are better than Hunter. Floyd or Wright would be better value than Hunter as well.

Your team is strong enough you don’t “need anything.” But unless you think that Hunter is going to become the next Ray Rice, 1.05 is a very compelling offer and every negative vote is someone willing to take that trade.

Josh G
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

Ok, here is my team

Stafford, Vick, Bradford

Forte, Foster, McFadden, Hunter

Megatron, AJ Green, Nicks, Dez

Graham

These are my keepers, and I am not allowed to keep any more than that number of players.

I also have 1.01, 1.02 and 1.10 picks..

So I am selecting Luck and T Rich, and going to trade Hunter and/or Bradford and/or Vick to allow me to keep T Rich and Luck.

So I dont need 1.05

GOT IT?

Cyrus
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

Once again, you aren’t showing why the 1.05 is not more valuable than Hunter.

Two things:
1- In my keeper league, before the keeper deadline, I could have your roster and trade Hunter for a 1.05, then keep someone else for this year. Therefore, there is a benefit to trading him as you get to keep someone else AND get the extra pick.

Whether you plan on keeping them in 2013 is irrelevant, your team is better off in 2012.

2- Similarly, it doesn’t matter whether or not you will keep Hunter next year. I think that anyone drafted at 1.05 will have more short term value than Hunter, and most likely more trade value than Hunter.

Therefore, I would do the trade with the anticipation that you can trade the player you draft at 1.05 for more than Hunter in the future.

GOT IT?

Josh G
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

Not at all..I value Kendall Hunter more than say..Lamar Miller/Wilson/Martin as of right now. That may change.but the fatc is, I would be losing Kendfall hunter for a player that would never see the light of day on my team.

For example..lets say 1.05 = Blackmon/Floyd/Martin/Miller..right?

My top 4 WRs are all better than them.

My top 5 RBs are all better.

At the end of the season, I’d merely give up the prospect of Hunter for someone I’d never use (barring massive injuries)..and may or ma not have trade appeal.

Cyrus
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

Well that is where we started, with me saying that most people here would trade Hunter for any of those players.

You wouldn’t. That is the best reason to not do the trade, because you value Hunter more than all of them.

Stating that you have 5 better RB and 4 better WR has no impact on whether to trade HUNTER for the 1.05. Because you have 5 better RB and 4 better WR than Hunter as it stands now.

So in your estimation, Hunter > Miller, Martin, Wilson, Floyd.

I think every negative vote is someone disagreeing, but you might have the next Ray Rice I guess.

Krcil
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

Josh I think you are looking at it all wrong… that 1.05 just needs to be better than your worse guy… which he is going to be unless you are playing on super small rosters, which drafting more than one round would be pointless…

Josh G
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

My rosters are 12 keepers. I have listed the players a few times already, and I have my 12, and thats assuming I trade and/or drop Hunter and Vick…keeping Stafford, Bradford, Luck, Forte, Foster, DMC, Trent Rich, AJ Green, Megatron, Nicks, Dez and Graham.

Hence 1.05 is meaningless to me because I dont value that player picked at that spot higher than any of the ones listed above…including Hunter. But I do think Hunter might prove to be more valuable to me this season than 1.05. If he explodes, I can trade Bradford perhaps instead. If he busts, I either can trade or drop Hunter. 1.05 is of no use to me..THIS SEASON. The following season is a different story altogether.

This is not complicated or a gray area to me at all.

You can negative vote me all you like, I won my league this past year..and am poised with talent and youth to compete for a while.

Sheesh

itsxwill13
Reply to  Luke
10 years ago

Traded Vick for Ingram Pettigrew and Kolb, needed 2/3 guys; lost Ballard for the year and my RB core consisted of Jacobs,Maurice Morris,Danny Ware

Dan
Reply to  itsxwill13
10 years ago

Josh, To have a roster like that and still have the 1.01, 1.02 picks? Are you playing in a league against your little sister or what? Just hard to believe someone that has that roster would actually value Hunter over a 1.05 pick. Its just make me think a little is all i am saying

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  Dan
10 years ago

Amen.

Laces out, Dan.

Josh G
Reply to  Dan
10 years ago

10 team league.

Just make smart trades..ie..

Larry Fitzgerald, Chris Johnson and 2 picks (late rounders) for Matt Forte and Roddy White and 1.02 and another late rounder

then flipped Roddy White and late round pick for Tampa Mike and 1.01

I finished first last year and lost in the finals the year before..but before that was middle of the pack..acquiring picks and players slowly but surely..thats why I am loaded now…but I struggled for 3 or 4 years.

Dan
Reply to  Dan
10 years ago

So you are also saying you had Fitz to go along with Calvin, AJ, Nicks, Dez and Graham and you had 2 of the top 3 rb to start the season in CJ2k and Foster plus DMC? IS there anyway i can get in this league? Please I could use the money. lol

Josh G
Reply to  Dan
10 years ago

I had Foster, JC, CJ2K

Picked up Foster in the draft the year before like everyone else.
Drafted CJ2k based on rotoworld’s recommendation when he was a rook.
I traded Gore+Witten for Vernon Davis+Megatron in the middle of 2010-2011 season. Traded Vernon Davis and err..someone.. for JC. Drafted Graham.

Anyway..traded JC for DMC, traded CJ2K for Forte…etc

You may think I have a loaded roster..and I do..but plenty of other good teams in my league..and a couple stinkers. The 7 of us who pay close attention, have great teams. The 3 of us who arent exactly die hard..have less than stellar..but its simply due to some players not working out at the time..like J Stew, Knowshon, etc..

Josh G
Reply to  Dan
10 years ago

forgot to mention..my team maybe is loaded with NAMES..but it doesnt matter if they dont produce.

The guy that finishes in 2nd or 3rd regularly has crappy name players..but its PPR and pts for KR/PR..so Burelson, Amendola, Cribbs, McCluster..etc..means he always finishes near the top.

lastly..lets not forget..JC, CJ2K, Forte, DMC all injured or played like crap the bulk of last season…had to make the moves…I got lucky with the result..was setting myself up by acquiring picks..for this upcoming year.

10 years ago

Well as the author points out; We only have 10 games with which to gauge him. There is no reason to trade him. If someone is trying to trade for him? Then they obviously think he has upside. So why should a buyer on Ingram take less than what they think he’s worth?

And also quite logically if you invested in Ingram than why would you cut bait SO QUICKLY?

I find it interesting that the author and pretty much everyone I know seems to ignore one of the most important upcoming elements in the Ingram saga. He’s going to have another HC for the next 12 months. That could utterly change his role in the offense in either direction.

I honestly think too many fantasy players make decisions TOO QUICKLY in this game on players and are too willing to wheel and deal rather than hold a potential asset and “build a team.” perhaps I’m NEW to dynasty but I’ve been playing fantasy football since 1994.

So I suppose the next few years will determine whether or not my thoughts are right.

I will say that I’ve been involved for over a decade in a 3 player keeper league (cant keep more than 1 player per position.)

I began by drafting Shaun Alexander/Marvin Harrison/Antonio Gates

I transitioned Alexander into Brian Westbrook at just the right time and transitioned Westbrook into CJ2k at just the right time.

Marvin Harrison became Anquan Boldin and then Megatron.

Antonio Gates was the last of my original three to go I turned him into Mike Vick…. we shall see if that works out as well as my other slots.

Anyway I think you can build the right way if your patient and make good decisions.

DLF_KenK
Reply to  Hamburglar
10 years ago

I think you make some good points there and echo some of the things I was trying to get across. Patience is a virtue lost in dynasty leagues, as evidenced by the poster here who says Ingram has been moved FOUR times already.

It’s way, WAY too early to accurately judge exactly what he’s going to be. As I said in the post, “If you think you can definitively say you know exactly how his career is going to shape up based on that small of a sample size, you’re either clairvoyant or drunk.”

I considered the coaching regime change some, but in dynasty terms, I really don’t think it matters that much. It will make a difference this year, but the interim coaches aren’t strangers and will run things the way Payton likely would have.

In the end, the expectations are what clouds Ingram’s value the most.

Thanks for the comments!

Reply to  DLF_KenK
10 years ago

Thanks for your response to my response. I think what I’m saying about the coaching change is that he does have a better chance of a new decision maker wanting to set him free if he has a dominant preseason running the ball. And if he is indeed a franchise power back once the Djinni is let free from the bottle? Ain’t like Payton would bottle him back up upon returning.

Saintsfan
Reply to  Hamburglar
10 years ago

Problem with that is that the guy who was calling the plays last year will be the same guy calling the plays in 2012

Scott
Reply to  DLF_KenK
10 years ago

I agree with Luke, in that Ingram will be hard to trade, as his owners will want too much, and prospective owners won’t offer enough. I haven’t seen Ingram move at all in my leagues. I think Ingram is just a hold and hope for 2012. If Ingram has another lackluster year in 2012, then I suspect his owners will be more willing to bail on him, and his price will adjust accordingly. But, I don’t expect that to happen this year.

You get what you deserve
10 years ago

Ingram sucks. He is the 4th best runningback on his own team and is trapped in a full-blown RBBC. Anybody who picked any Saints RB with their first pick last year deserves this past season (and future seasons) of statistical mediocrity from this overrated “workhorse” back who couldn’t even get through 10 games without injuring himself. Boom. Roasted.

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  You get what you deserve
10 years ago

This is DYNASTY. It’s people like you who make winning leagues very easy. Ingram will be 24 years old when his rookie deal expires. I’m not saying that he is a sure fire future RB1, but his prospects certainly look better than the players taken 3, 5 and 6 in most rookie drafts last year (Thomas, Williams and Leshoure).

I had the first pick and got AJ, so before you can ask, this isn’t resentment talking. Remember when Jamaal Charles was the “third best back on his own team”?

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  Sensei_John_Kreese
10 years ago

I’m sorry..I misquoted you, you said that Ingram was the FOURTH best. Meaning that you look at Chris Ivory as a better player.

Miguel
Reply to  Sensei_John_Kreese
10 years ago

I’m going to agree with the above guy and say that yeah, Ivory is better.

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  Miguel
10 years ago

If Ivory could stay healthy, we might find out.

Krcil
Reply to  Miguel
10 years ago

Ivory has a hard time making the roster and they couldn’t even trade him this off season. So he can’t be thought of that much around the league.

Reply to  Sensei_John_Kreese
10 years ago

Yes I remember when Charles was the 3 best back on his team. 1 of the other backs Priest was the best FF backs of his time. The other Larry Johnson was a stud for a couple of years. Charles situation was Completely different then Ingrams situation. One of the problems Ingram has is the NFL is to fast and strong, its not college were he was a bully and ran at will. But ten games like you said is still to little of time

tebow
10 years ago

i love to buy low on talent so if i could get him for less than what i think he is worth ill jump all over it. almost all rookie rbs get hurt/fumble/etc their first season because they dont know the nfl. show patience and it will pay off,thomas and ivory arent going to hold off ingy for much longer. these guys learn to take care of themselves better as they get older they never played against grown men before remember that.

Josh G
Reply to  tebow
10 years ago

Agreed..I just dont have room for the guy with Forte, McFadden, Foster, K. Hunter and soon, T. Richardson.

Then again, most of my RBs are constantly injured…so..I could always use another rb 🙁

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  Josh G
10 years ago

Just for sayin…I don’t understand the thumbs down stuff either. If you guys disagree with me, reply. We are all competitive people here. If we weren’t competitive, would we be here at DLF?, would we be looking to gain a competitive advantage in our fantasy football leagues…in April?

Really looking forward to the interacting with you guys on the live draft blog.

Rob
10 years ago

Similar to a previous post, Ingram has been moved often (3 times so far) in my league. In the latest trade, I acquired him. I gave Meachem and a 2013, 3rd round pick. Just shows you (as stated) how impatient owners can be.

Now, don’t get me wrong, I think Meachem could finally reach his potential in San Diego (could also give a better return sooner than Ingram), but no way I get Ingram for that seven months ago.

Since Meachem would never crack my lineup (Start 3 WR- and I have Calvin, Fitz, AJ Green, and Julio), it was clearly a no-brainer, and a move made with the long-term in mind.

Hooray for impatience!

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  Rob
10 years ago

This is how you win leagues. Why would anyone trade Ingram when his value is the lowest?

StevieMo
Reply to  Sensei_John_Kreese
10 years ago

Ingram is a talent waiting to happen. Like Jonathan Stewart, it will happen. Buy low right now.

pancakes
Reply to  Sensei_John_Kreese
10 years ago

Trading Ingram at his historically lowest value is perfectly rational if someone believes the value will never go back up.

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  pancakes
10 years ago

after ten games?

Scott
Reply to  Rob
10 years ago

Wow. In my leagues, I wouldn’t even make an offer of Meachem/3rd round pick for Ingram, because it would get rejected fast. It’s good for you, though. I wish I could get Ingram that cheap.

Al
10 years ago

Yeah, let’s write a whole article on Ingram and not point out that Ingram is slow and average-sized. Forget the situation, he’s not big/fast enough to be a RB1. Total overdraft based on being part of a good college team, doesn’t have the skillset to have been picked in the first round.

Scott
Reply to  Al
10 years ago

To a degree, I think you are right. Ingram fell in the draft for a reason. He’s not exactly fast, and his situation stinks. Ingram in New Orleans is a nightmare right now. The coaching change with Vitt might actually help Ingram’s value. Heck, it cannot hurt, since Payton ran the RBBC from hell. I am still a bit surprised at all the hype Ingram got last year, while everyone seems to loath Shanahan and Belichick for their RBBCs. Payton has arguable the most frustrating RBBC, and yet it seems like nobody nails him that hard for it. Guys like Roy Helu and Ridley get dinged because of their head coaching and RBBC situation. Ingram is in the same situation with Payton, and that should theoretically put him on that list with Helu and Ridley.

StevieMo
Reply to  Scott
10 years ago

It’s not always about being fast. Emmitt Smith wasn’t fast. Ingram’s quickness and short-area strength will make him a 10-12 TD guy for years to come. His TD per game ratio will be very high, as it already is.

DLF_KenK
10 years ago

This is great!

I figured there would be mixed feelings on Ingram, but the passion here is astounding. He’s truly an enigma right now. He may lack the size and speed, but I don’t think we can say that definitively right now. He was banged up last season and lost in the offense. We only saw ten games of him and I don’t think that’s enough to say we have any concrete answers on any subject regarding Ingram.

He’s definitely a high risk / high reward player in dynasty.

pancakes
Reply to  DLF_KenK
10 years ago

to me, his greatest chance of ever becoming a RB2 would be when he’s 24-25 and a FA and gets picked up by another team.

that being said, he doesn’t have strong physical abilities in any particular area to fill any particular role. ingram is more of a victim of the times than anything.

Meens
10 years ago

people are too quick to point out sproles and pierre thomas and sean payton as reasons why ingram is under used. bottom line is those guys produced and he didnt. the saints have to win games now. they have RBs that averaged 6.9 ypc, 5.1, 4.7, and 3.9. The bottom line is that ingram was much less effective then the other backs on his team in rushing and is a distant 3rd as a Recieving back. To get more chances you have to outperform the guys ahead of you. Why would anyone expect it to be a given that Ingram hops over Sproles and Pierre Thomas this season? All i know is that I’m not buying Ingram, and in the league I do have him I am looking to sell him. I’m sure people were saying that it would be dumb to trade Moreno at his lowest value in previous years. Maybe today is the highest Ingrams trade value will ever be again?

Josh G
Reply to  Meens
10 years ago

That is the conundrum isnt it? Never sell at the low..but perhaps he never gets any higher….

This is why I traded CJ2K last season..his value was lowest..but..I wanted reasonable value. Made offers for a few players in similar value range (McCoy, Ryan Mathews, Forte, Rice..ie all top 10 RBs with some bias against MJD because of his knees).
I got Forte for him.
I also won my league last season (ironically, no thanks to Forte!).

But Ingram’s value is tough..hence the “Dynasty Dilemma”!

If you are able to get whatever you perceive to be a fair value for him..then by all means, sell. If you dont like the guy and get a fair value, then why hold to someone on the off chance he performs in a tough situation? We all have players we like or dislike. I dont care that S-Jax or MJD are studs, I generally dont want any part of them due to injury/age..etc.
Ironically, I am not a huge fan of Forte, but feel he is more tradeable than CJ2K.

And if you don’t find anyone willing to give you YOUR fair value, you might as well hold and see if Ingram’s value returns and maybe soars. Obviously worst case is he either injures himself this season or turns in several dud weeks in a row and his value plummets.

Tough call and good luck.

Rob
10 years ago

Yeah, I was not the biggest Ingram fan either, but I do think he was a 1st round RB for a reason. There is talent. Is there elite talent? Top 5 talent? Probably not. That’s why I drafted Julio over him and made a strong push trade-wise for AJ Green. Both of those players WERE elite in my mind last year before our draft.

But given what I gave up (Meachem) and my team’s make-up, I’ll be patient and hope for RB2 numbers at some point or when he shows some flashes, I could sell. Point is, I’m confident that I can certainly get a better return than what I gave from a RB desperate owner in the future when Ingram does show something. Turf-toe is no joke and shouldn’t be dismissed as lack of talent.

Good debate BTW!

fffool
10 years ago

If I own Ingram, he ROTS on my roster before I sell low; to call him small (5’9,215 (Ray Rice-5’8,212)) is nuts, and to say he possess an “average” skill set is lunacy (He’s got primo shakes & very good hands). A Sproles or Thomas injury gets me significant touches, and if BOTH get hurt-I win the lottery!

THIS MESSAGE PAID FOR BY THE NATIONAL CHAPTER OF HOMERS FOR INGRAM.

tebow
10 years ago

so would u take spiller or gramy for 2012? people are always caught up what happened last year instead of seeing ahead. young talent always wins over thats why i dont worry about jackson with spiller and i dont worry about pierre/ivy with gramy. sproles does a whole different thing. i dont know who i rather have though i lean towards spiller just because he is ready right now

itsxwill13
Reply to  tebow
10 years ago

i took a flier on both i own spiller and ingram and the 1.1 my team will be such a young rb core

tebow
Reply to  itsxwill13
10 years ago

so gun to your head who would you rather keep ingy or spilly?

itsxwill13
Reply to  tebow
10 years ago

haha this is interesting i would say ingram just because the team is better and they would make it easier on ingram plus spillers been around alil longer and last yr was his first positive note.

10 years ago

Maybe he went out on Bourbon Street drinking hand grenades and stubbed his toe walking into Larry Flynts which required surgery………. hahahha

Reply to  @chriscrane27
10 years ago

my “comical relief” for the day ^ because this Ingram situation is a headache

🙁

F B Nut
10 years ago

I drafted him no. 1 pick rookie, in two leagues and traded up in both leagues to get him. At this point I wont trade him his value is still great, as far as potential.

The question that I have is on some web sights they are caiming that Trent Richardson is the next coming of Adrian Peterson. When at Alabama he didnt beat out Ingram, the last year Ingram played there, they split the carries, but Ingram was the man at Alabama.

So how does Richardson jump up so high in fantasy owners eyes, and Ingram drop so low, yes the injurys, plus the stable of RBs at New Orleans. But im still high on Ingram and have no problems waiting it out, my leagues are Dynasty.

Thats my two cents worth.

StevieMo
Reply to  F B Nut
10 years ago

I’m likely to end up with Ingram and Richardson, which will make my team name the obvious, “Bama Backs.”

Rob
10 years ago

Part of it is expectation. If Richardson fails to produce immediately, there will be a fair amount of owners that will jump ship too early as well.

As far as Ingram starting over Richardson in college, there’s an entirely different set of nuances to the college game. Tom Brady sat behind Brian Griese. Barry Sanders sat behind Thurman Thomas. Sometimes, when talent level is perceived to be somewhat equal, the nod goes to the guy who has put in more time (the senior for instance).

Does that make Griese and Thomas better than Brady and Sanders? No way.

Richardson’s talent level has nothing to do with sitting behind Ingram. He just had to “wait his turn”. Most would agree that his talent is significantly higher than Ingram’s.

VoiceofUnreason
10 years ago

Thurman Thomas was an amazing HOF player but anyways most of the guys who underperform are too slow, not big enough or lazy after “making it.” Not sure about Ingram but people are panicking. You won’t gain much selling him now but you could lose a lot.

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  VoiceofUnreason
10 years ago

I’ll take Thurman Thomas in PPR all day

#GoBills

Rob
10 years ago

I realize Thurman was great. My point was that in many cases, “who started over who” is not a good barometer when assessing talent, especially in college (where the talent level is not as high as the NFL). There are plenty of HOF, NFL players that sat behind college players that never made it to the pros or ones that had great college careers, but did not have the skill-set that translated into a good NFL career.

Almost everyone sits behind someone at some point in their careers, whether it be in pee-wee or the NFL.

So, to make a connection that Richardson must be < Ingram because he was behind him on the depth chart at Alabama is not a good way to approach skill assessment.

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  Rob
10 years ago

I think everyone understood what you were getting at. All good and valid points. Ingram was the defending Heisman Trophy winner, he had a wonderful career at Alabama. That doesn’t necessarily mean he has the better pro skill set.

I would also like to add to F B Nut that I don’t believe any reasonable dynasty owner is down on Ingram. After he was taken by the Saints, we had an idea that his potential was limited to RB2 status at best, at least in the near term. Look at Darren Mcfadden’s first 2 years. Give it time.

StevieMo
10 years ago

Every now and then I have to say again that this is a great site.

Wells vs Ingram Dilemna
10 years ago

Ingram owner says he might be willing to trade Ingram for Wells…. yay or nay? (ignoring rosters.. just value of player vs value of player, standard, dynasty)

Sensei_John_Kreese
Reply to  Wells vs Ingram Dilemna
10 years ago

Thats actually really tough. I don’t see RB1 potential from either one. I say if it is PPR, go Ingram. If it is not, Wells.

Cyrus
Reply to  Sensei_John_Kreese
10 years ago

Honestly, I am low on Wells and would go with Ingram regardless.

To Top